ritual to buy check is a researcher
writer and speaker on issues pertaining to the impact of of the religious right
on policy and politics great to speak with you rachel thank you so let’s start at the beginning here
tell me a little bit about and a are what do those letters stand for and what
is this movement nam apostolic reformation uh… this is a movement that’s really
growing in the religious right it’s led by pastel pronounced apostles and profits and is dramatically changing boat destructor but many churches uh… that form what we would call the
barger religious right or evangelical right and also on much of the ideology of peace and ministries i’ve been major factor i a uh… about
this statement is that they believed that they have to
take dominion over government and society
before jesus can return which is a very different idea uh… dan has been popular or in
american fundamentalism for many generations was believed that the the true believers would be taken from the earth before the end of time
and the poor jesus return rate so that it’s the latter part would tend to be
like this rapture idea right which at a certain point is that there will be a
selection made so to speak and some people will be able to live the
for attorney presumably in heaven and then everybody else will perish is that
roughly accurate that’s frankly accurate and of course in that scenario elective
really terrible in time worsen separate take place after
the believers have been rapture to happen look like this area i was quite different and this scenario the believers are
still on earth as these things are happening so i think this is part of
quits adding two but what we could say the diac in times hysteria that we’re seeing in
parts of society so the believers will be left on the earth in order to to fight evil and to fight
the anti christ themselves tip hard at this change with the apostolic reformation is the
idea that these believers must take control over society in
government themselves before jesus can return and this is encapsulated enacting a
concept called the seven mountains so the idea is that these believers must
take over arts business education family government media and religion and by before i get to the rick perry connection to all of this
i kind of a i have a kind one historical question for you which is how far back and we identified these
kind of and time prophecies uh… in history i mean we we
have we certainly know that for at least a couple of thousand years we’ve
experienced them but do these date really far back i mean can we find
evidence of the and time prophecies uh… about much further back in human
existence well we start we certainly fine
christian and times prophecy uh… dating back to many hundreds of
years as part of the crusades another historical events now in terms of of american uh… specifically american
fundamentalist in time ideas uh… anderson air ticket dates back about a
hundred and fifty years the narrative that we were discussing about the believers being fractured before the and now this shifted that we’re talking
about a dramatic shift an american and times theology has taken place but say over
about the last thirty to forty years and and i would say accelerating rapidly in the last ten to fifteen years to what we call dominion as them or a disbelief that that at this particular brand of christianity must take control over society and
government that is too many innocent that tell us about the repair a
connection to all of us well this is this became news after rate
carries august sixth prayer that in houston texas called a
response and every said it is that the large
number of these apostles and profits national an international leaders in the
movement were part of the event others were there that were not visible
on camera and the and that was organized by two
major new apostolic organizations one called the call headed by a profit lou ingle and the
other the internet international house of prayer led by mike beckel who also led a
substantial part that prayer that so i hop in other words
we could so i have yes the other ipod and your international house of prayer
is now uh… popping up around a close and in
cities across america so it’s a chain so to speak day e_s_ yes in some ways it is they are
interconnected bayliss train from the main i hop in kansas city na where the
call is also based incredible and so rick perry has not really other
than we covered that prayer that back when it was going on with gary has not really made any of
this and his involvement in any of this very clear during his kind of more
mainstream presidential campaigns has the or is it there in ways that maybe
just aren’t that clear to the average uh… a news view well there there are ways that might not
be it’s so clear for instance uh… and i hopped leader in florida was chosen as
part of court carey’s campaign there and so forth and i think that what has happened is
that that that rick perry has bina and expect after work tell your as a candidate at the national level in
ways that were not anticipated in basement uh… and so so i think it dead that the support has not been as a parent because rick perry’s
campaign has not gone very far however keep in mind that at the same a lot at the same organizations a lot to
stay in money behind rick carries that behind what’s called a at united and
purpose champion the bag which has been holding pastors uh… policy briefings around the country for years an another regular feature nbsp halsey
briefings is newt gingrich i said now we week seeing newt gingrich
uh… take a turn in sort of dave the republican candidate mary go around the
spend and taking place and perhaps some of i’ve been biz that newt gingrich cod that came from the extensive exposure
that he’s had treaties pastors policy briefings which have been
held uh… in states across the nation and
particularly and i left south carolina and florida over the last several years when you talk about the goal of taking
over family and education in government et cetera tell me a little bit about what are some
of the methods and means is the takeover involve kind of a strategic thought-out process is it potentially a
violent type of takeover of these areas i mean how far it is this movement apo
potentially go well let me stress that that printed at
the major architect of the movement in the united states see peter wagner states that there does not have to be
any type of violent overthrow and in fact he doesn’t like to use the
word theocratic he says that this can be done inside of completely democratic means just by the growth of the movement in
britain popularity of commitment so in other words you think that if the
movement becomes large enough and outreach is is effective then they can take this control just it just through bhejna democratic means and taking uh… over policy and a structure in the seven mountains absolutely and do you expect that would
any of the candidates who immune i would assume that romney is not apart of this
in any way he is a completely different religious background being the mormon but if gingrich does end up being the
nominee and correct me if i’m wrong on romney but if you gain which ends up
being the nominee do you expect will see the more allusions to this to this type
of in the mainstream depressions their first of all you are
not incorrect about ron a coca mormons are not considered to be christians at
by this movement unless they have actually been eventual iced i believe it has worked for has worked
with some mormon candidates for instance in hawaii but these are people who are considered
to be avenge allies to their former police right and and on the other point i think what but we will see uh… let’s take a merchandise become the
canada i think we will see a lot of organizing
and may not be apparent to the general public but a lot of organizing and promotion i’d cambridge through the existing networks enough to
start preparation has what they call prayer warrior networks and all fifty states uh… they’re much better developed in
some states and others but if you look back at two
thousand eight when fair pay one was named as the vice presidential candidate and had close ties to the movement there
was an enormous amount of networking and promotion apparel in that went on
behind-the-scenes uh… throughout this fifty-state
network opinion apostolic reformation all right well there it is rachel to
botched think researcher writer speaker uh… obviously incredible work you’re
doing here on the religious right and exposing the stuff so thanks so much for
joining us great to talk to you bank you know